CWA Organizing: White-Collar Power

White-collar organizing sweeps the Tech and Game Industry! Learn how the Communication Workers of America (CWA) is converting non-traditional industries like college campuses, newspapers, and the Tech and Game Industry into union shops. CWA District 3 organizing coordinator and grassroots activist, Cassie Watters, gives us the skinny on what motivates these white-collar workers to organize and how the CWA supports these digital employees.

Some highlights from CWA Organizing: White-Collar Power:

 04:10 – Campus Workers Fight Back

10:14 – WILL)Empower

13:03 – The Importance of Mentors and Mentorships

16:23 – CODE: Coalition to Organize Digital Employees

https://www.willempower.org

Transcript

Narrator  0:02  

This is The World of Multiemployer Benefit Funds with Traci Dority-Shanklin. We believe in demystifying retirement solutions, upholding retiree dignity, and contributing to economic stability through union organizing, pension reform, and legislative activism. In short, we're devoted to busting myths about the labor movement. If you're interested in the enduring power of labor, well, you've landed in the right place. Experts and activists will share their insights, expertise, and stories. Time is short, so let's get started.

Traci Shanklin  0:34  

If you're just joining us on the podcast, my guest is Cassie Watters. Cassie is the organizing coordinator for District 3 of the Communication Workers of America. CWA District 3 covers the southeast United States and Puerto Rico. Cassie has dedicated her entire career to activism and grassroots organizing. Is CWA seeing more organizing among millennials or Gen Z?

Cassie Watters  1:05  

Definitely, at all levels. It feels like organizing is becoming -- more people are becoming more aware of it and having access to what it means and to some of the tools for how to organize and then are reaching out in larger numbers to our union and to other unions.

Traci Shanklin  1:25  

Is there any particular industry that seems to be more dominated with the millennial and Gen Z generations?

Cassie Watters  1:34  

It seems like all of these industries we've been talking about, so tech and game, as well as non-profit. On the campus level, we certainly see graduate students, as well as undergraduates, organizing, so I think in all of those industries, we're seeing a lot of folks from that those generations.

Traci Shanklin  1:56  

So, organizing has been, I think, a very newsworthy topic. To your point, there's an uptick in the amount of calls you're getting and that kind of thing. And I've had many conversations with other guests regarding the next generation of leaders. And we touched on with the CWA's affiliate the United Campus Workers at the University of Tennessee in Knoxville. I loved how students, faculty, and staff united it, which I think is such an important piece to getting things done. And your role gives you like a front-row seat to how this generation or the next generation is feeling and what is their push. Is it still the dignity and respect you speak to? Or is there something else that's motivating them? Because it seems to be a very activist-driven generation.

Cassie Watters  2:53  

It's the same basic issues. You know, I think people are tired of being overworked or not having enough work, whether it's that their industry's being part-timed, and they can't get enough hours or benefits, or they're being overworked. We're seeing both of that. But, the basic, the same issues are present. I think people certainly talk more about some of these ethical issues and the impact that their employer has on the climate, or, for instance, their ties to certain industries, whether that's the criminal justice system, or to other corporations that show up on campuses or make partnerships with universities, calling those things out. The role their employer plays in the world, I think is another important difference.

Traci Shanklin  3:59  

If you had to define it, who is this new generation of leader?

Cassie Watters  4:05  

I think it's yet to be seen, because part of what to me needs to also unfold is the sort of meshing of the worlds of the generations of if this new workforce is going to become part of existing union locals, that the two-way street, the intergenerational learning process has to unfold still, I think, to a large extent. Or will we see, I think we'll see that and a combination of forming new locals where people are becoming leaders for the first time. And so have to experience what that looks and feels like. And then hopefully we'll see some mentoring happening. And that's where I think a group like WILL Empower is a really good example of trying to foster some of that.

Traci Shanklin  4:54  

Yeah, it's interesting because we're at a time where pre-COVID, and I'm not going to date this exactly right, but there was a lot of talk about like, company ethos, like, what do they stand for? What is their internal work, sort of personality? And it sounds like more and more that's being exposed. In this moment where we're coming off of a moment that is being coined as the Great Resignation, a lot of that seems to be driven by like these toxic work environments. And I think, as you were saying it, I wrote down the mentorship programs are such an important piece or this idea that these companies almost embrace in a new way, but an old way of grooming people for the next tier of their career. Are you doing anything like that? Are you educating employers on how they might implement systems like that? 

Cassie Watters  6:00  

Well, I would say workers themselves could be the engineers for those kinds of programs, but their voice is not going to be heard unless they organize, especially if it includes suggestions about sharing power and control. And that's, that's what a union is, is an effort to, right, force an employer to share power and control. And so, if a workplace is organizing, then the union of the workers there, I think will have more success at some real change, by organizing around those issues and creating campaigns that put pressure on employers to make good on some of those promises.

Traci Shanklin  6:49  

You're talking about this coming from inside, so we're seeing more of these homegrown acts of solidarity and affiliate union activity. And, I mean, what do you think workers, whether union or non-union should know about the union brand, that maybe they didn't know or we're not aware of?

Cassie Watters  7:09  

I think it's just really important for people to realize that the friction that they might experience, and that's putting it nicely, on the job is about management using power and control. The only path to changing that is to use your collective power as workers as employees and to organize because, right, power concedes nothing without a demand. That's the Frederick Douglass quote, and it's being used right now in a campaign I'm involved with CWA called, Call Center Workers United, right, where you have a federal contractor, an entity that our federal government has contracted with the Center for Medicare and Medicaid Services to do all the customer service work. 

Cassie Watters  8:02  

But, right, they have had to fight to have the $15 minimum wage, which Biden did institute for federal contractors, but what about their ability to organize and to have their employer be neutral? And so, that's one of their current demands that campaign with this corporation called Maximus. But you know, will the Biden administration step up to help allow that given that this is a federal contractor? This is somebody that we're paying to do this work, and so people to know, people to know that how important it is to ask themselves, how could the world be different? And that unions are a really important part of that answer. Together, we can use our power. There's a different way of doing this.

Traci Shanklin  8:51  

Often, a life trajectory can be determined unfairly by race, or sexual orientation, or zip code. How is the CWA addressing economic and structural barriers that can help this new generation of leaders, regardless of what generation they come from? 

Cassie Watters  9:13  

Yeah, I think paying attention to mentorship and to mentoring people of color, or right, whoever is reflected in our workforce needs to be reflected in our leadership. And so creating pipelines, where people can be mentored into more leadership roles, I think, is one commitment that's been made internally. And so, I think taking on issues like racial justice in public as a union is another important way. We had a day of action about George Floyd. That created a lot of conversation in the union. I think It's important to be as visible as we can, together with others in the labor movement in the streets in moments like that, because that's whenever people understand what's possible. 

Cassie Watters  10:14  

But, in terms of the mentorship piece, I did put WILL Empower in the chat there, Women Innovating Labor Leadership. Elaine Windham is one of the people who got that started among others. And it seems like an important, very new, but growing opportunity to have people enter into apprenticeships, I know we had people in the United Campus Workers participating in that. I hope to see programs like that grow, that can partner with unions, and organizations to help people step into more leadership.

Traci Shanklin  10:52  

Yeah, we'll be sure to link that in our show notes for this episode, you talk about the George Floyd. I'm a white mother, obviously. But I have a black daughter. And personally, I've learned that it's not enough to acknowledge that there's a race problem in America, but that I, personally, must find a way to be part of the solution, so I think you mentioned it already. But, we're witnessing a shift in awareness in my industry, which is the investment industry, thanks to the Time's Up, and #MeToo, and Black Lives Matters movements, that's really forcing all of us to elevate our diversity report cards, so your work gets you really up close and personal with this undercurrent. Are you seeing companies, I mean, do more to achieve diversity? Or are they doing the right thing without necessarily being pushed by the union?

Cassie Watters  11:53  

I don't think that it happens without pressure. And I don't think it's real without organized pushes. Because I do think there is a danger of buying into some sort of illusion of diversity, equity, and inclusion programs that don't address real questions of power. And I think that comes back to organizing, and to the presence of unions in workplaces, which is the only thing that really forces the sharing of power and control. And so, programs like that can be part of what a given union addresses, like how do we make this program real? And we as the employees need to have a voice, and we need to have seats at the table when you're deciding on the priorities. That's how those programs I think, are going to be made to be more real.

Traci Shanklin  12:52  

Yeah, it's an ongoing report card, if you will, like when you have that organized or collective voice of people, I think we have to do a better job of changing the way maybe companies even go about looking for employees, doing more to broaden that thinking to for these companies to get bold and step outside of their box of what, where they're even looking for their employees. 

Traci Shanklin  13:23  

Post-COVID, we've had the most unusual job market. The latest US Bureau of Labor Statistics Report has come out and shown that there were 4 million; it's 4,527,000 quits in November 2021, which shattered all records, and September's were higher than August, so they've been growing. And it just it's a trend that doesn't appear to be stopping. So, as an organizer, what do you think is fueling all this discontent and causing such a reshuffling in the workforce? 

Cassie Watters  14:05  

Yeah, I think some of it is people asking how could the world be different? And if people aren't making enough to live on, or if they're not being treated well, what are the alternatives? It's like the need to make a living and be treated well on the job is I think one of the biggest factors driving it. And I think the surge in organizing this showing that as well.

Traci Shanklin  14:37  

Are you seeing any fringe benefits emerging as hot buttons? Benefits, like healthcare, or pension plans, or any of those?

Cassie Watters  14:48  

I think healthcare is a huge issue across the board. These workers I mentioned who work for Maximus in these call centers, doing customer service for Medicare, Medicaid, and CDC, among other contracts that they have state and federal, they themselves have a huge deductible. And they just had a small victory in pushing for better healthcare, but those things don't happen without pressure and exposing. Again, this is a federal contractor, how is it that they're the ones talking to people about affordable healthcare over the phone, and they themselves don't have it? And so, by pointing that out, I think we've seen, you know, some small wins. There's a lot further to go. 

Cassie Watters  15:39  

Pensions -- I could talk to you about that for a while just having worked with the public sector and with the United Campus Workers and a pension attack that happened in around 2014. In Tennessee, where they changed the state retirement system from a guaranteed benefit to a hybrid plan that included a 401k. This is very common, but they did it in the same year that our -- our state plan won the award for the best-managed plan of its kind in the nation. 95 plus percent funded, no issue. However, right, it's the higher levels. It's like the Moody's bond rating was going to affect our state's rating, because pensions are now considered a liability on the state's report card. 

Cassie Watters  16:36  

Why did that happen? If not to just take people's money and put it, right, into the cloud to be able to gamble with, and it's like, there was no problem. We had done all the right things. And yet they still changed the state pension because of these larger forces at work. But one of the ways they were selling it, the same Governor Haslam, his administration was selling it was young people today want flexibility. Young people today don't want to be tied to one job for their life. But, if they do have a job, shouldn't they earn a pension?

Traci Shanklin  17:16  

Yeah, I could opine on a little bit of this, but we are short of time. But, I will say that I've done a lot of conversations on hybrids. And while I'm a proponent of them as a solution to a failing plan, it is a shame to hear that they're being used in a time when there's there's no need because defined benefit are just that are have proven over time to be the best source of retirement income, and really are a promise to have a retirement with dignity. And it's a shame to hear those stories. 

Traci Shanklin  17:18  

As for young people, I think part of the problem is, look, when you're young, you're not thinking about what am I going to do when I retire? Or how am I going to support myself, or any of those things? And those are conversations or educational pieces that need to be brought in earlier in people's life. Regardless of whether you have a pension plan or a 401k, there is a meaningful conversation. And it is a little soapbox issue for me that I think we're missing a massive piece to really the economic security and what could be a retirement crisis of a massive magnitude if we don't deal with it, so based on your experience partnering, do you think labor union organizing can be re-energized by taking advantage of this unique, I think moment of worker activism?

Cassie Watters  18:53  

I think we've got to build our capacity to be able to seize on it, so there is a bit of having to rise to the challenge. So, will we invest in organizing? Will we invest in what it's going to take to seize the moment? I think, is a really important question for the whole labor movement.

Traci Shanklin  19:15  

According to a Pew Research report, I read a third of the voters in 2020, identified as Independent at 34%, while 33% identified as Democrats and 29% identified as Republicans. If we look at our current political divide, and with more than a third of all voters identifying as Independent, can you or can do you think this can this new American Majority could be the beginning of a third party political party?

Cassie Watters  19:49  

It could. It could very well. I think people are going to watch what our existing parties do. Not just what they say, but what they do, and so they'll make their voting decisions accordingly. And having an alternative, I think, is important to create some pressure to make change, and to listen to the will of the people.

Traci Shanklin  20:19  

When Biden took office, he proclaimed that he would be the most pro-labor president of our time. And I'm wondering if you could help us understand if there's an appetite for pro-worker conversation in the political climate today?

Cassie Watters  20:38  

I think there is. These things never happened without active movements of people, pressuring: voters; working people; union members; community members pushing, you know. It's, I don't think we've ever seen a president and I don't think we ever will that's just going to deliver on promises without any movement from people in collective action. I do think we're seeing significant changes in, for instance, the National Labor Relations Board makeup, and they're the regulatory body for labor law for federal labor law. I think the appointment of the Secretary of Labor was significant with Marty Walsh. I think, some of the task force that have been created and the access that workers have to speak in hearings; some CWA members have been able to do that. And then some of these massive bills represent what's possible, but it has to go a lot further. I don't think it will, without very significant movements from millions of people becoming active in their workplaces, you know, and in the streets.

Traci Shanklin  21:57  

So before we sign off, is there anything that you would like to leave our listeners with or that you think they should know about you or about the labor movement?

Cassie Watters  22:08  

I'm personally inspired by and excited by Jane Mcalevey, and some of the programs that she has been initiating with trainings for any worker, any group of workers who want to sign up. It's called Organizing for Power. She's partnered with an institute. She's got several books out, but just that model that this is up to us. Like this is up to workers to learn how to do this to create high participation unions. Or if you don't have a union, to figure out how to form one. And so, those trainings being offered on a large scale is very inspiring to me. It's not necessarily any particular union, it's open to all. So I just wanted to make sure people were aware of that.

Traci Shanklin  22:59  

Well, I really appreciate you being part of the conversation today. And I appreciate your time. And I look forward to seeing great things from the CWA and your work as an organizer.

Cassie Watters  23:12  

Thank you for having me. It's a really great conversation. I appreciate it.

Traci Shanklin  23:17  

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Narrator  24:15  

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Disclaimer  24:38  

Sisu Partners LLC hosts The World of Multiemployer Benefit Funds podcast which contains content and discussions that have been prepared for informational and educational purposes only. No listener should assume that any discussion on this podcast serves as the receipt of, or substitute for, personalized advice from an investment professional. As the information provided on the podcast is not intended to be investment, legal, or tax advice. The company is not an SEC-registered investment advisor and does not solicit clients or raise capital for money managers. Sisu Partners offer securities through XT Capital Partners LLC.